Hello Empowered Principals. Welcome to episode 380. 

Welcome to The Empowered Principal® Podcast, a not so typical educational resource that will teach you how to gain control of your career and get emotionally fit to lead your school and your life with joy by refining your most powerful tool, your mind. Here’s your host certified life coach Angela Kelly. 

Jeff Linden: All right everybody, today we have a special guest. This special guest is somebody that is near and dear to my heart because they kind of helped me out as a principal throughout my journey. So I’d like to welcome to the show, Angela Kelly. Welcome Angela.

Angela Kelly: Hi there, Jeff.

Jeff Linden: Hey Angela, I wanted to kind of get things started here with just kind of talking about your journey in education. So, tell me about how you got into education. What is the reason that got you to become a teacher in the first place?

Angela Kelly: Wow, that goes back a few decades. So, you know, like any kid coming out of high school, the big question is, what are you going to do with your life? And for me, I actually need to start back into middle school. I was in middle school. I was attending a brand new middle school. My family had moved a lot. And there was this presentation in our theater, and it was called Upward Bound. 

And it was a program that was designed for students of families who had not – they’re the first generation of students to potentially go to college. So nobody in my family line prior to me had attended a four-year university. And you also had to meet certain requirements financially. So my family fit these financial goals. And by the end of eighth grade, I signed up for this program called Upward Bound. 

It was at Iowa State University. I was born and raised in Iowa. And it was the game changer for my life because I don’t know that I actually had sites on going to college. I didn’t really contemplate what my future would look like. It was that life was just happening and I was just going through the motions of being a kid and going to high school. And then this happened, and I started thinking about my future, actually thinking about what I wanted when I grew up, the kind of career I wanted to have. And I went through Upward Bound for five years. 

So from the summer of eighth grade clear through the summer of the year I graduated. So five summers, instead of being the kid who, you know, went to movies and hung out with her friends and went out on dates, I was going to college. I was going to school through this program. The first couple of years, they are prep courses to prepare you for the rigor of college. 

And then the last three years, you start taking actual classes with other college students while you’re in high school. And then you have an intense amount of preparation and support and tutoring to ensure because if you’re going to get anything lower than a C, they kind of pull you because they they realize you might not be ready. 

So, I was able by the time I graduated high school, I had a semester of college credit. And that was so invigorating and so motivating. I had this momentum going where like I started to identify as somebody who could actually go to college and get a degree. I have to highlight that because that program really did change my life and I credit the Upward Bound program too, creating a vision for my adult life and my future. So I have to give a shout out to Upward Bound.

And then when I got into college, I actually… my dad was like, well, you should go into finance. That just sounds very prestigious and you’re really good at math. And I took one semester. I hated it. I was falling asleep in the class. I remember in economy class, I slept through a quiz. It was just bad. It was bad news. 

And I was sitting down with some friends over the summer and they were asking how college went. And I said, well, it’s okay. But I wasn’t fired up. I was more fired up about the social scene and being, you know, away from family and being a little independent college student than I was actually my future and learning.

I had a very profound conversation about what did I want to do? What did I love to do? And in that conversation, it came up like, I love kids. I babysat from a very young age. I loved being around kids. They lit me up. And I loved school. So I think the combination of truly loving school as a student, I always played school, I played the teacher, and combined with my, you know, young adult love for children. And I would say too, I’m really wanted to improve the experience of school for students.

And not that I had a bad experience, but, you know, I grew up in the 70s and 80s, so there were things that we could do to improve the experience of students and the emotional experience that students had in addition to the style of learning that we did. So that really, those combinations of events in my life drew me into teaching. 

And the minute I shifted into from finance into education, it was like lock. I knew right then, I was locked, loaded, this was my life. I loved it, ready to go. And that was it. I never looked back. And I ended up getting my early childhood credential along with my elementary, you know, teaching credential.

Jeff Linden: All right, as a teacher, how long were you a teacher?

Angela Kelly: I taught two years in Minnesota. So I graduated from Iowa State, we moved up to Minnesota. I taught pre-K. It was a birth through grade age five, early childhood program. I was the teacher and the coordinator for two years there. My husband and I moved out to California in ’95. And I taught at the same school for about 15 years. 

So I taught primarily kindergarten, it’s my love language is kindergarten, and I also taught first grade. And then I became an instructional coach. I was a reading specialist. So I did, you know, different seats on the bus, but I was definitely elementary. Really profound love for early literacy and early childhood development and just the social emotional development of children.

And I really loved working with parents. That’s why I chose kindergarten because you can just, you get to bring them in and you get to cultivate them and their experience. And that was really important for me to set the stage for these families to have a positive experience with their school and to really love the school that they were sending their children to. 

So, I did that for 15 years. And in the meantime, I’m going to say like around 12, 13 years into teaching, I felt this desire for more, but let’s be honest on the podcast here. You know, when you’re a teacher and you’re like, it’s teachers, they have their mindset and perspective and then admin. 

And as a teacher, you’re looking at the admin like, I don’t know about that. I don’t know if I want to go to the dark side. I don’t know that I could handle it. You know, deep inside I was like, I don’t know if I can handle it, but on the surface it was like, I don’t want to be like one of them. I don’t want to have to work like that or, you know, I just you have thoughts and opinions about it because you’ve never experienced it. So you can only imagine, you know, what it would be like.

And we go both ways. We imagine that it’s going to be amazing or we’re going to have this big impact and what, you know, it’s going to be better than ever. It’s going to, oh, we’re going to get out of a classroom, we’re going to be able to walk the campus and we’re going to have all this freedom and power. 

And then you also think about, ooh, that looks really hard and they’re the ones who stay last and they’re the ones who eat last and they’re the ones who, you know, take the heat and I don’t know if I can handle that. Am I capable of leadership, actually leading a vision, a school, a community? And so that I was feeling it and it was just kind of, I was keeping it on the inside. Well, my superintendent at the time was offering this program.

So if any of you out there listening are teachers or site administrators or district administrators, which I’m sure there’s a bunch of you out there listening, this program was another, like I think about these little milestones in my story that at the time, I had no idea the impact they were really going to have, but I could feel like it was a calling to go into that. 

This second little milestone for me was this program, we called it ELA, like it was like basically it was a leadership development program and my superintendent had the brilliant idea of like cultivating leaders from within the district and not always trying to hire somebody outside who didn’t know our culture or understand, you know, our vision. And it was a two-year program. 

We’d go once or twice a week and it was pretty intense, actually. It was more than I thought it was going to be, but it was a profound group of people with of my own peers and we talked leadership and we talked straight leadership. We didn’t sugar coat it. We talked about how it actually felt to be a leader, the real challenges, the work-life balance issue, time management, how do you get planning in, just how do you keep it all together emotionally when teachers this and that? And it really gave me perspective and insight.

But the best thing it gave me was I went from thinking I’m not cut out, it’s not possible to like, I think I can actually do this. Did you have that moment, Jeff?

Jeff Linden: Yeah. So in my journey as becoming a principal, honestly, I was a teacher in the classroom for 11 years as a math teacher and coached football, wrestling, track, you know, did all those things. I love it. You know, I love the connections with the kids. It honestly wasn’t until I got into Omaha where I was actually, I moved went from Millard North High School as a teacher to Ralston. And the main reason I went to Ralston was because of Dr. Adler, who was the superintendent at Ralston.

My main question was, could I get into your leadership academy if I come over? Because at the current district I was in at Millard, I had to wait three years. And I did not want to wait three years. I kind of wanted the training because I felt like it would be good for me to be able to have some more background in becoming an educational leader. I had my credentials already. I had curriculum masters and I also have my educational administration masters. And so I was like, I need to have something more like leadership academy, maybe it’ll be make me more marketable.

And so I spent two years in the Ralston Leadership Academy with Dr. Adler, which was a great experience and that kind of propelled me into becoming a principal and having some experiences and some just insights on what that’s like. So kind of very similar pathways there. 

So tell me more about like, you know, you’re going from a teacher into becoming on the dark side now, right? Coming a principal, you kind of talked about that, you know, piece where you went into like a leadership academy and how did that propel you? What was the next step to making that transition from teacher to principalship?

Angela Kelly: I went through the program and it was two years. So, yeah, it was like an academy and we graduated out of that. And then shortly after that – so there’s this period of time and I was in California at the time. I lived out in California for 30 years. So my career really spans primarily in California. You know, you had to go through the motions of getting the credential. And because I already had a Master’s degree, I could go through kind of a, it was like a shorter term credentialing program offer because they were in need of administrators.

So they had this kind of like limited time bonus, if you act now, you can go through this program through the county or the state and add on your administrative credentials. So I did that. And then I, you know, you have to take the test and I remember driving down to Santa Cruz, California and taking this test and it was just old school like handwritten six hours straight of just writing and writing and I thought, oh gosh, I hope I passed this test.

And you’re just like a kid again, like waiting for your ACTs or your SAT scores to come back and it came back and I had a nearly perfect score and I was like, what? Oh my gosh. And I thought, you know, there was the celebration moment. I’m like, gosh, I’m ready for this. And then I thought, it’s one thing to write it down on a piece of paper. It’s another thing to live the experience and to be in it, right? And Jeff, you know that. That is definitely true. There is the theory of leadership and there’s the life of a leader and there’s the leadership, I think day-to-day, right?

Jeff Linden: Yep.

Angela Kelly: Yeah.

Jeff Linden: Yeah. And I know like for me, transitioning from teacher into becoming a principal, did I really know what I was getting myself into? Not really. I just knew that was my next step. And for me it was like, I was looking for that person to give me the opportunity. And I did a series of interviews because at my time, there was a lot more competitiveness becoming a principal in Nebraska at that time because, you know, everybody that was a teacher that wants to get into a principalship was trying to get into those or you’re competing against other candidates that might have some more experience.

So getting into it, you know, it was hard, but once I got that opportunity, that’s when I was trying to make the most of it. And so that’s part of like, for me, becoming a principal, I had the education, I had the academy, I had all this knowledge. Now I had to put it in practice. And that’s the part that gets tough because there’s not a lot of professional development out there for principals and for people that are just get stuck on an island because my first principal ship was out in Southern Valley.

It was, you know, out in the middle of South Central Nebraska. Our school was set in a cornfield basically. I mean, we had our conference principles, we had our – in Nebraska, we had educational service unit, which we go to to do some professional development, but there wasn’t a lot of ton of stuff out there. 

And then for me, about two years in, I started searching for professional development. And that’s kind of when I ran across your podcast, The Empowered Principal. So tell me something about, you know, going from that principal leadership, what was that like? But then transition into getting into becoming the empowered principal person you are. Like you basically help other principals manage not just the stresses of the job, but also their life.

And so kind of tell me about your principalship a little bit, but then kind of go into you becoming the empowered principal, which you actually wrote a book, The Empowered Principal by Angela Kelly. Yeah. Which kind of is the basis to what you do now. So kind of tell us about that journey.

Angela Kelly: Yes. So fast forward to my first principalship. I got tapped on the shoulder by the superintendent. And here’s what I want to say about this for the listeners out there. If you’re an aspiring leader or you’re even considering, you’re listening to this podcast with Jeff because you’re thinking about becoming a leader and he’s inspiring and you’re like, oh gosh, Jeff can do it. I want to do it. I want you to know this. 

Like it’s an identity conversation with yourself. Like feeling capable, being capable. So if you’re not in the position yet, I want you just to imagine what it would look like, what it would feel like, you know, what the experience would be and start to step into even in just your mind, just kind of role play what it might feel like to be a leader and get yourself into that identity of being a school leader. That’s going to help you transition. It’s going to feel easier to actually cross that threshold into being that. 

So in my situation, my experience was I got tapped on the shoulder. It’s your time. You’ve got to apply for this. I actually applied to be the AP of a middle school because I thought AP would be easier transition into leadership. Well, I didn’t get that position. I was, you know, really sad at the time, but my superintendent said, I have other plans for you. And so he hired me as a first-year principal to open a brand new school, a brand new campus. So…

Jeff Linden: Brand new principal and you got a brand new school? Let’s talk about adding on the stress. I had enough issues with just the construction and putting a new Hvac last summer and getting the building ready and I’m going in my seventh year and that was enough stress again to do that. I could not imagine being a first year principal opening a new building and tell me more about that.

Angela Kelly: Yes. Well, I’ll tell you those first two years. So I was opening a brand new site. So it was a brand new group of people, brand new community, brand new physical building. So I was dealing with construction and I love to tell the story. It was back to school night. It’s like a week into the brand new school year. It’s my first five days on the job with people on campus. 

Back to school night, parents are coming, children, campus is full of people. And the office calls and she said, Houston, we have a problem. She said the main water pipe broke and there is raw sewage running down the central campus. So I had to be like, okay, everybody to the side. But I mean, metaphorically, that’s how I felt. I was literally waiting through all of, you know, the newness and the craziness of school leadership. 

And these crazy moments were happening. And but, you know, all humor aside, it was the hardest two years of my life. I was a single mom at the time. My son had just transitioned into middle school. He was a sixth grader. And I was a single parent trying to operate a brand new school and, you know, I had to really set the foundations. I had to create the site council team and, you know, this all of this, all of the teams had to be developed, vision, all of that. And so that was not the empowered principal moment that I was having. That was like probably the most disempowered two years of my life.

And there were some moments I just felt like it was happening to me. Like the job is coming at me with a fire hose. I can’t keep up. I was staying so late at work, having other people pick up my son, other people take him to his events, going in super early, staying super late, working nights and weekends. And I really thought, how did I get myself into this? And I don’t know how to get myself out of it. And that’s what I really felt like, I had no power.

So, fortunately, the district assigned me a mentor. And by the way, I forgot to mention that not only was I a brand new principal at a brand new school, they only allowed me to work there three days a week and they had me working at the district two days a week to fill another position that was, yeah. So I was spread a little too thin. 

So all of that to say, if I’ve gone through that, I’m sure somebody else listening has been through that too. So we feel you, we hear you out there. And you can only do so much, right? Everything gets watered down. So you do the best you can. But I had a moment, the second year into my school leadership where I thought, I don’t know if I can do this. And that’s when I was searching online for help. 

And you’re right, Jeff. That was the first time I noticed there’s a huge gap in support at the admin level. It’s, hey, you got hired. We’re so happy you’re here. Here are the keys, go figure it out. But please don’t come back to the district asking for support because we’re too busy dealing with other things. 

And so you really are figuring it out on your own and it’s very isolating and it’s scary. There’s a lot on your plate, a lot of responsibility and you’re thinking about students, staff, community, you know, of course test scores come in and scare the, you know, the jeebies out of you. But at the end of the day, I was desperate to be successful. I wanted to want the job. I wanted to want it and I wanted to be good at it. And that’s when I literally Googled where to look for help. 

And, you know, you can go to a conference, you can read a book, you can talk to your peers. That was about what was available. And I love going to conferences. I love socializing, I love learning, but there is you go and you’re motivated and inspired and then you come back into the realities and it’s hard to integrate what you’ve learned for the long haul, like integrate it into your identity as a principal, your methods and your approach into leadership.

And so the next, how long was I a site leader? Two years at that school. Then they moved me back to my home school. Now, I am the boss of my peers of 15 years. So, I don’t know if you’ve experienced that. I think a lot of principals become the leader of their peers. There that is an interesting dynamic to have to navigate. 

And so again, there wasn’t internal support. I sought support outside, but what I found was life coaching. I didn’t know what life coaching was, but I knew I needed one because my life was a big mess. I was not feeling like I was doing anything well, being a parent, running my household, being a good principal, being an instructional leader.

So I found this person, Dr. Martha Beck, and I signed up for her program, not to become a life coach, but to learn what it meant to coach my own life. I wanted some empowerment back. I wanted some agency and I wanted a sense of control somewhere along the way. 

And from her, I learned just some techniques to just kind of regulate myself emotionally when I was overwhelmed or to stop and take time for myself to just literally make sure that I’m drinking water, make sure that I am, you know, eating lunch, making sure that I put time limits on the amount of work that I did.

So I started playing around with this idea of I’m a human in a school leadership role versus I’m a school leader and that’s my only identity because that job’s never done. We all know that. The same goes for students. If there are students listening to this, you might just think like the studying’s never done, the learning’s never done. And on one hand, you’re right, because we are lifelong learners, but on the other hand, there needs to be something more than studying, learning, test scores, achievement, and that there needs to be living. So there’s all the doing, but then there’s also the living.

And that’s where I got my first little breath of fresh air like, I’m going to be a human in this job, not just a robot trying to keep up with the demands and the wildness of school leadership. 

Jeff Linden: Yeah. So you’re talking about just, hey, yeah, I’m a school leader, but I’m also a person, right?

Angela Kelly: Yes.

Jeff Linden: So how does that mindset going into it? Yes, I’m a school leader, but yeah, I want you to see me as the person who I am. How did that help you build connections into your principalship and your leadership when you started discovering those things through your life coaching experience and your journey on that?

Angela Kelly: It was profound because what I did was I started paying attention to what I needed as a person. You have physical needs, right? You need sleep, you need food, you need movement and exercise, you need rest, you need to have pleasure and playtime in your life. You need this full experience. 

So the more I tuned into me, the more I started realizing that we are more connected than separate. That was the profound change where I started seeing teachers as just fellow humans, as fellow people on the planet. And I started thinking, we’re all here for the right reasons. We’re all here doing the best job we can, trying to figure this thing called education out, trying to figure out life. We’re all here.

And we all want to feel good. We all want to feel included, significant, important, valued, connected, appreciated, cherished. We all want to feel the same feelings. And so that, when I realized what we’re striving here, what we’re striving for in education is human development. We’re striving to, you know, support our young ones, our students with tools and skills to navigate the human experience, not just the learning, not just academics, but their body, physically changing and developing and growing and their, you know, their ability to interact with their peers and to build friendships that have meaning and fill their hearts with joy and fun and laughter and memories.

And same with teachers, like teachers go into this for the right reasons. And if you believe in that and you believe that your story is more similar to their story than separate, we aren’t admin and teachers, we’re humans, we’re educators. And that team, when I saw that we’re a team, we want the same things. We want kids to be happy and successful. We want them coming to school. 

We want to feel good about ourselves as teachers, whether we’re an admin, whether we’re the secretary or the nurse or the counselor or, you know, tech support or bus driving or maintenance, we all want to feel good about who we are and what we’re contributing. And that’s when I realized equal contribution but different, equal value. 

So our contributions, whether you’re a teacher, whether you’re maintenance crew, we all are contributing something valuable, it just looks different. So we’re more together than separate. And then I started teaching that with kids and they would come into the office and have their disagreements and have their conflicts. And I would be able to start talking with them about the similarities and how we want to feel the same way and what we really want is to feel good about ourselves and our connections with people.

And then from there it just it started rolling. I started getting how to be a leader, which was connection and similarity over separation and disconnect. That’s when in 2015, I was looking like, how do I get more of this? How do I become a stronger leader, a better leader? And you know, Jeff, again, there’s a little bit out there for school leaders. Like it was starting to percolate, like there’s organizations that provide incredible learning connections. I love it. 

And there was just this little piece for me personally that was missing. And that’s when I found The Life Coach School. I went and got certified in 2015. And I applied those concepts for two years as a principal. Then I got promoted to the district level. I was the RTI coordinator for the entire district. We were able to build a really robust academic RTI and behavioral RTI program at my site. And then I was supposed to go and help my fellow peers do the same at their schools. Well, one year at the district office is if you’ve ever moved from site to district leadership, ooh, that’s like a whole another level of perspective.

And I was like, okay, I can do this. But I did. I felt disconnected from kids. So I spent a lot of time at the sites. And what I learned is that principals were coming together in the district at the leadership team meetings. Everyone had a smile on their face. Everyone was saying everything was great and this is what they’re going to do and problem solvers. And then when I go back to their sites and we close the office door, the truth came out of how they really felt and the struggles they were facing and the pain they were in and the insufficiency that they felt.

And the disempowerment they felt, they felt a lack of ability to inspire and create influence and impact in their school as a leader. And it’s because that identity and leadership skills and all of that was missing from the conversation. It was be this task manager, like, and I’m sure you run a school because you went from a small school to a big school, right, Jeff?

Jeff Linden: Yeah, I went from a school with about 75 students to 1,000.

Angela Kelly: Yes.

Jeff Linden: So I made a pretty big jump. And kind of the great thing was is when I was getting ready to make that jump, that’s when I found your podcast, what you’re doing. I think we had like a free consult and we kind of worked through some things because I was getting frustrated because I was looking for at the time, how can I become a better leader, but also, I need help because something I’m doing is not working and what is it?

And I think that’s when we talked about, you know, a lot about your mindset. You took me through the STEAR cycle, we did some brain drains and we were really able to focus in on kind of what I needed to do to get into, you know, the right mindset for that, to show people my value, show people that, you know, envision myself into their school and how do I do that? And so we worked a lot on that. 

And of course, I was following you on Facebook and I listen to your podcast and so I was just kind of falling along because I needed something to kind of help me through the journey because you’re right, when you talk about, you know, go to these conferences, you network, you do these things. I even go to, you know, our regional state conferences, our regional meetings and things like that, but then you go back and then you’re on your own again.

So what can you get daily? And I think that’s kind of where you’re kind of fitting into that piece to where you can help principals on the daily with becoming a better leader, but also being the best version of themselves. So, honestly, this podcast was is a derivative from working with you because knowing that there was not a lot out there, my goal with this podcast is basically to connect people with other people, but also tell other people’s stories, but also try to help other principals in these situations or in these leadership roles to be the best they can be. 

And if I can help inspire and give them some nuggets of knowledge here and there, that would help them so they don’t have to go through some of the hard things you had to go through or other previous principals had to go through as well because I think you’re going to go through some dark times as an educational leader, but to have somebody kind of support you through that, it is an important piece.

And I find that’s kind of where what you’re doing now going from your district leader role. Now you’re the empowered principal guru, life coach, you kind of, you know, help people with that and you stay pretty busy doing that. So talk about that transition. You talked about, you know, I went to become a life coach. You were starting to implement practices. 

I think the one thing you really kind of talk about in your book is, you know, your mindset, your thoughtfulness or just how do you think, you know, your brain works and your STEAR cycle kind of… So kind of talk about the STEAR cycle. What is it? Why is it important to help you become an empowered principal?

Angela Kelly: Yes, of course. I first have to do a shout out for Jeff because Jeff and I worked together as one-on-one client and also he was a member of my group coaching program at The Empowered Principal Collaborative. But what I want to highlight about Jeff was how quickly our conversations went from just talking to him implementing.

And I don’t mean so much like he didn’t add more to his plate, he adjusted his approach. He didn’t add to his plate, he adjusted his approach by like broadening his perspective. And it’s funny to have some conversations recently and I listen to all that he’s done. I listen to the podcast. I follow him on social media, but your perspective and the way that you tell stories and the way you connect with people. 

And just the other day we were talking about, you know, how we support fellow adults to have conversations and conflict and to resolve those as adults. We have to be able to hold space for them. And I just think Jeff does an incredible job of implementing mindset plus skill set and that supportive approach and that really the belief that, hey, we’re all here to feel good, to do our best. We are on the same team. I see that in your work, Jeff. I see it in your posts, in your work, in the conversations that you and I have. And this podcast is really a manifestation of that work that you have done, right? I was there to initiate those conversations with you and to provide that awareness and get to get you feeling aligned to what you value and who you are.

But from there the momentum was all use. So Jeff is an incredible leader and I’m I couldn’t be happier that he started this podcast because he has so much wisdom to share with you guys. And what I love is this is just the beginning. So I have to say that because I respect him, I appreciate him and this work that he’s doing. He’s not just talking at you in this podcast. He’s living it and sharing his stories and experiences with you in real time. So I really honor and respect that. 

So back to the question was how I transitioned. So that one year at the district, I saw people suffering is really what happened. I saw my peers suffering and it pained me. It ate me and I thought, we really are the same. Like, I felt that way too. I thought I was alone and isolated. I thought it was just me. I thought I was the one who was insufficient or I didn’t have what it took or I wasn’t charismatic enough or smart enough or, you know, organized or disciplined enough. But I see that it’s the job. 

And so if it’s not the people that are the problem, and the job is the job, it’s just the reality. If we can’t go out and change what the job is, but it’s not us, then what? And that’s when I realized there needs to be a way for people to take their personal power back and to feel empowered in the job even on the hard days or even when the test scores don’t land where we’d like them to or even when we’re working with a kid who’s really struggling to regulate emotionally or working with an adult who is really struggling to regulate emotionally. 

And why don’t we just have a space where principals can talk about this? Talk about like, I’m barely emotionally regulated right now, let alone being able to help somebody else regulate emotionally. We expect kids to emotionally regulate, yet we sometimes don’t have the capacity to do that ourselves.

So just in my own observation of me and through The Life Coach School, I came up with my coach calls her work the Model. And I took that and ran with it and created the STEAR cycle. But it it’s just a tool, not just, it’s a powerful tool. It is a tool that helps you observe what’s your brain is offering you, your thoughts and just observe them kind of give a little distance between you and your thoughts to create that space so you can write them down onto paper or, you know, type them up. And you can – that’s what the brain drain is where you can just like, wow, like what is going on for myself right now?

And I’ve shifted a little bit like I wrote this book when I was a baby coach, a brand new coach. And, you know, it was like my pride and joy at the time. And I’m writing another book right now actually to…

Jeff Linden: Yeah?

Angela Kelly: Yes, breaking news. Okay, I will. But I’m just, you know, the combination of this work has really expanded my capacity to coach and to offer support for people. But in this book, I really focus on using the STEAR cycle as a tool where you look at your thoughts. But what I realized is that the emotional experience we’re having is truly the compass. 

So you still look at your thoughts, but what I would offer to you now is, what are you feeling? Being able to identify because sometimes you’re feeling all worked up and you don’t know really what’s going on inside. And you’re going to have a brain drain. Trust me, like if you’re upset or you’re frustrated or you’re overwhelmed, the brain is going to go, well, there’s this and let it drain all out. 

And eventually, you’re going to be like, okay, I got I said my peace and you’ll feel a little release of energy there. But that practice gives you some space in your mind to say, okay, I’ve acknowledged how I’m feeling. I’m overwhelmed or I’m upset. Here’s why. So what are you feeling number one? Why are you feeling it? That’s the brain drain. All the thoughts are going to pour out. And then you have some space there to be like, huh, okay, I’m acknowledging that I’m overwhelmed or I’m really upset right now. Valid, fair enough. Now what? And you can look at the thoughts.

You separate them from your mind because they kind of just one, they go on repeat, they loop over and over and it feels like there are 200 thoughts when actually there’s probably 20. They’re just on repeat and loop and then they get all jumbly and entangled in your mind and you kind of go down these rabbit holes, but putting it onto paper, it finite them. You start to see like there’s only so many. 

And then you can say, okay, here’s what I’m thinking. How is that feeling? Which one of these feel terrible? And which ones feel a little better? Let’s lean over there. And that’s what my next book is going to be about. It’s called Feel Good Goals. It’s about the goal here is to feel good. And we use this process to like lean back into what feels more aligned, what feels true, what feels good. 

What do we want to believe about ourselves, about others, about our school? So that’s the gist of The Empowered Principal is how can I take back, empower myself to feel better, to learn what’s working, what’s not, what do I want to shift and do differently? But also, this is another secret, is that if you’re having a thought that feels terrible, like, I’m not good enough or I really messed this up or, you know, I’m a failure, I’m insufficient in some way. We all have the not enough thoughts. When they feel terrible and you feel like you’re in so much pain, the little secret is that they’re not true.

That’s just your brain’s way of saying like, hey, you know what? I don’t want you to feel the pain of failing. So I’m going to just tell you in advance, don’t even try because I don’t want you to fall down and, you know, scrape your knee. I’m going to protect you and keep you safe. And the brain can’t differentiate between real pain and perceived pain. So it’s just it’s going to freeze you and say like, please don’t try this at home. This could result in pain, whether that’s physical pain, emotional pain, mental pain, psychological pain.

We’re so afraid of pain. But if we lean into it and we’re looking at the STEAR cycle and it’s like, ooh, I’m really feeling some pain here. Like, let’s say we failed. Let’s say we did. And we acknowledge it. It’s better to validate that, acknowledge it and lean into it and be like, you know what? And this is true. 

I think I taught you Jeff something called the land of and, where it’s like, this might be true, but also equally true is this other side where you can start to feel better. So even on those hard days, it’s like, yep, today was hard and… what’s equally true are these other things that are good. There’s the duality of our jobs. There’s really hard days. 

I just moved here to Nashville and in real time, I don’t know for those of you who know, there was a school shooting recently just this past week. And there is a principal out there and a family, multiple families who are in the biggest pain of their life. And to me, losing a student on my watch is one of the most unimaginable things. And that principal is in so much pain and we can feel compassion for that principal. And it is like probably our biggest nightmare and fear as a principal is losing a student on our watch when it’s our job to protect them and also knowing we do our best, but we aren’t in control of the world.

And so then it becomes, how do I navigate this heartbreak, this pain? And pain is pain, right? Whether you’ve lost a student or you’ve lost a staff member or whatever tragedy of any kind that’s happened at your school. And hey, if you haven’t had a tragedy, don’t feel bad that you haven’t had one. 

Whether it’s like an IP that didn’t go well or a parent that got upset and left your school or there’s different kinds of pain. We all experience it. So acknowledge your pain, lean into it and just know people like Jeff are out there. And Jeff spent through pain too. He’s been through really hard times and really hard conversations. He’s had to lead people. He’s had to coach people up. He’s had to coach people out. So you do both, but your willingness to expand your capacity to feel pain also lets you expand your capacity for joy. And that’s the duality of this job.

So that’s really what I do in a nutshell is I help people navigate this thing called educational leadership. I help you navigate the hard stuff emotionally, mentally, but I also help you visualize and learn and expand your potentiality and your possibility about what you can be, what you can experience. 

And hey guys, at the end of the day, we’re all here to support, to love, to have a good time and to create memories, to create success stories, to be proud of ourselves, our students and the work that our teachers and our team are doing. And that’s your legacy. That’s what you want to leave behind. 

But here we are today, Jeff, this will be a memory locked in time, an experience that you and I are creating. And then tomorrow this will just be a memory and it will be a beautiful memory. It’s one that we want to lock in and remember this forever. But all of us are doing this. We’re all out there at our schools.

You’re present in the day and that tomorrow, the next day, this day is a memory. So that brings me to just kind of, I know we’ve been talking so long here, but wrapping up this podcast episode, it’s really about intentionality, who we want to be, not perfection. We don’t even want perfection, that would be very robotic. We want to experience it all. We want to have the capacity to experience it all. And that’s something that I see Jeff modeling, not just as a school leader.

Jeff models it as a husband, as a friend, as a father. I see him on his Facebook, guys. So he can’t hide. I know. He’s doing the work here. But, you know, this is really my story is I’m just leaning into how can I help people experience this job in the most profound, empowered way so that you can enjoy your life. You can enjoy, you can have balance. You can work hard and go home and play hard. You can get the rest you need and put a lot of effort in. You can have both. And believing that it’s possible to have both is where we start.

Jeff Linden: Yes. And that’s really what I love about the work that you’re doing is how you’re helping principals not just manage the job, the task that at hand, but also how can they just be a someone that can enjoy just being, you know, a husband, a father, a good friend, you know, somebody that’s, you know, we are people outside of this job.

We’re not just, we just don’t go home and do nothing. We got interests, we got things we like to do. And so you being able to tap in, I think you’re the only person I know that has the experience being a teacher, a principal, a district admin, but then this life coaching adventure you’re on where now you’re helping people navigate that job, navigate how to find the joy out of it because like you said, it’s a tough job. 

There’s going to be, you know, great days and there’s going to be good days. I always say because I’m not I’m a non-traditional educator. I worked in a factory for three and a half years and I always tell people the worst day in education is better than the best day of my factory job. So I just enjoy what I do, but at the same time, I think it’s that mindset that we come in with, but also having someone like Angela Kelly here to help you navigate is something that, you know, I would encourage principals and educational leaders to tap into.

So Angela, tell us, you know, what you’re up to with The Empowered Principal? You know, how can people connect with you? You know, how can they reach out to you? I’ll probably, well, I’ll put some your email or some connections down in the show notes so people can easily find you in the podcast, but, you know, how can people connect and get in touch with you if they’re really thinking about, you know what? A lot of the things that I heard today resonates with me and I really want to learn how to have that work-life balance. How can they connect with you?

Angela Kelly: Yeah, absolutely. So I jumped into this job around, I think 2017. So I’ve been coaching for the last eight school years. And I started with one-on-one coaching. As Jeff knows, and then the demand expanded into, I do have some one-on-ones. I don’t coach, you know, a ton of one-on-ones anymore, but I do coach one-on-one with some principals.

But the majority of people are coming into The Empowered Principal Collaborative, which is a group coaching program. And what I love about that is the synergy. It’s the you don’t feel alone. Like one-on-one is where we have those confidential, private conversations. And I do offer one-on-one sessions to the members of EPC if there is something confidential in nature or sensitive in nature that we need to discuss offline. 

But what’s so great about the group is the collective wisdom, the collective desire to feel good, to improve, to expand their impact on their schools, to also to like not take it all on themselves, like to lighten that load, to not feel alone. I thought teaching was isolating because you’re in your classroom by yourself, but you have your colleagues, you have your grade level team or your department team.

And then you get into admin and for me, 550 students, you know, 27 teachers, you know, about 70 staff members at my site and one admin on campus. That felt isolating. And I was like, okay, there’s got to be a place to go mingle and have some conversations and have a little bit of fun and actually just lighten up about it, laugh about it. Like some of the stories, you cannot make these up and you’ve got to be able to have a place where people understand you and they can laugh and have a good time. So EPC, The Empowered Principal Collaborative is my group coaching program.

So if you are interested in learning more, number one, you can just listen to the podcast and kind of get to know me, The Empowered Principal® podcast. You can pick up the book, audio, it’s on Audible, it’s on, you know, you can buy the hard copy if you want. And then you can find me on my website, AngelaKellyCoaching.com. But The Empowered Principal is where I’m at. I hang out primarily on Facebook and Instagram, but you can also find me on LinkedIn.

Jeff Linden: All right, Angela, it was really great to have you on the show today. You know, it’s fun to listen to just your journey as an educational leader and how you became the empowered principal you are today. And I really appreciate the work you’re doing because it’s meaningful and it’s, you know, something that we as educational leaders need. You know, I hope today’s podcast helped someone out there today, get connected with you to help them become a better educational leader. So thank you for being on the show today.

Angela Kelly: It’s so wild to be a guest on a show. Like I have my own podcast and I spend my time being the interviewer. And so it was a blast to be here with you, Jeff. And I’m excited to actually share this interview with my audience as well for them to hear your story, but also, I don’t know that I’ve ever really shared my story to this depth. So it was really fun and just thank you for the privilege and the honor of being here today. I had a lot of fun. Take care.

—

Hey you guys, calling all first-year site and district leaders. As you know, I hosted a free master course for those aspiring to land a job in school leadership. This was a four-day course that covers what you need to prepare yourself before, during, and after the interview process. So for those of you who are interested, you can find the YouTube links below in the show notes. The Aspiring School Leader series is completely free. 

Now, for those of you who landed that job, I have a brand-new program. Let’s make your first impression in school leadership your best impression. Let’s lead your school with confidence in year one and nail your first year as a school leader. You’ve got what it takes to make an impressive first impression, so come on in. 

I’ve got a brand-new program called Essentials for New School Leaders. It is three months of professional and personal development to give you the strategies, the mindset, and the skill set to lead your school to the next level of success.

There is a gap between the time you get hired and the time you start your contract. Let’s get ahead of the curve, three months in advance, you’ll be ready to go on day one of your brand-new contract. Join Essentials for New School Leaders. For more information, click the link in the show notes.

Thanks for listening to this episode of The Empowered Principal® Podcast. If you enjoyed this episode and want to learn more, please visit angelakellycoaching.com where you can sign up for weekly updates and learn more about the tools that will help you become an emotionally fit school leader. 

Hello empowered principals. Welcome to episode 378.

Welcome to The Empowered Principal® Podcast, a not so typical educational resource that will teach you how to gain control of your career and get emotionally fit to lead your school and your life with joy by refining your most powerful tool, your mind. Here’s your host certified life coach Angela Kelly.

Well, good morning, my Empowered Principles! How are you feeling today? Here we are, end of March. You’ve made it through the longest month of the spring. So congratulations. I know that March can feel like a very long month. There’s a lot of days in March. There’s a lot of pressure in March.

There are a lot of decisions to be made in March, and you, my friend, are handling them. And I want to celebrate you. You only have two to three months to go, depending on what part of the country you live in, what your school district’s timelines are. But some of you are done at the end of May, and some of you are done at the end of June. So I am rooting for you.

So for those of you who have two to three months to go, make sure you’re planning out the last eight weeks of the school year. And be sure, please be sure to be planning out your Summer of Fun Challenge. And for those of you who are on Facebook and you like to have fun, if you are both of those things, come on in to the Empowered Principal Facebook group where we do our Summer of Fun Challenge. I do lots of fun prizes and encourage people to get out, have fun, and to be inspiring to other people. And really what we’re doing is we’re raising the bar to see how much fun we can have as school leaders during the summer and during the entire school year, I would venture to add.

So congratulations on making it through March Madness. I know that it can be a challenge. So as we close out March of 2025, I just want you to notice, we’ve already been through January, February, and March. We are a quarter of the way through the calendar year. And I say that to bring up awareness and to help you realign with who you are and who you want to be and how you want to feel and what you want to experience. It’s been a wild ride in 2025 and I want to create that awareness.

And every week you listen to this podcast, I want you to be thinking about, with intention, the experience you want to have in your school leadership experience, in your career, with your children, your relationships, your relationship with time, your relationship with your money, your relationship with everything around you. But ultimately, the life you want to live, the life you want to lead, the legacy you want to leave behind.

And I don’t mean being some famous person when I say legacy. I just mean your personal legacy, what you value, what you cherish, how you’re going to be remembered, creating those memories with your loved ones while you’re here on the planet, while they are here on the planet. We’re not ever guaranteed another day, another year. So why not make the best of this day and cherish this day and appreciate this day?

So as we’re wrapping up the first quarter of 2025, look back at the last 90 days. Look at your last plan. What did you celebrate? What did you learn? Where did you grow? What accomplishments did you create? What experiences did you have? Who did you connect with? Celebrate your life, acknowledge it and enjoy it.

Okay. Now this podcast is going to be pretty quick because what I want to do is show you how we can create problems for ourselves. So I was coaching one of my EPC clients. Once a month, you have access to a free 30 minute one-on-one session with me as a part of being in the Empowered Principal Collaborative. So you get the best of both worlds. You get weekly coaching, you get all the collaboration, you get the connection and insight from like-minded people.

But then you also, if you have something that’s churning at you or something that’s private or confidential, once a month, every EPC member has access to a 30-minute one-on-one private session with me as a part of the membership. Now, this client has been working with me for several years as a one-on-one client. And when I opened EPC, she did both for one year and now she’s an EPC exclusively. And she scheduled a one-on-one session with me and it caught my attention because this client is pretty savvy at coaching herself. And I know that when she does schedule a one-on-one session, there’s something going on for her.

So we connected. I asked her what was going on. What did she want to coach on? And she felt very distraught. The way that she introduced her problem was that she was going to have to have a hard conversation with a teacher who was very set in her ways and is a very good teacher. So the principal was feeling conflicted because she felt she had to have a difficult conversation, a very uncomfortable conversation with a teacher who she saw as being very set in her ways, but also being a brilliant teacher.

And I asked her, if this teacher is brilliant, what’s the hard conversation you’re having with her? And she said, it’s about collaboration. This teacher has extremely good interactions with children. She gets results. Her classroom’s on point, like teaching wise, we have no problem. But in the principal’s mind, the way that the teacher collaborated was a problem.

And so she felt like she had to address this problem. So stay with me here, because if you have a person like this on your campus and you’re like, they’re such good teachers, but dot dot dot, they’re not good at relationships with adults or they, whatever they do. If you’re in this boat, which trust me, I’m assuming, and I know it’s an assumption, but I’m presuming that there are many of you in this boat because you have people who are really good and this thing or really good, but this thing. Okay. Stick with me here.

So I listened to the story. I allowed my client to brain drain all of her story about what was going on and what was wrong and why it was a problem. And I can’t share the details, obviously, with you, but the gist of it was the colleague, this teacher, had been in a gen ed classroom and now she’s an intervention teacher and there was multiple intervention teachers, and the colleague of the teacher wanted to collaborate differently than she currently was with her colleague and she felt that she was being met with resistance.

So hear me out. The person that the principal had planned to have a difficult conversation with was a person who’s an excellent teacher, but whose identity, based on other people’s opinions, was a difficult person to get along with. Now, it could be true. I don’t know the person, which is great because I can stay super neutral.

So this person perhaps does not collaborate in the way that people would expect, or maybe she does engage with adults differently than children. We oftentimes do. So when we got down to the core of what was going on, I said, what’s the real problem here? Is the real problem that teacher needs to collaborate in the way that the colleague wants her to? Is that the problem? Is the problem that the colleague doesn’t feel connected or supported to her peer? Is that the problem? Is the problem that because somebody came and said something to you, now it’s a problem that you have to solve and you feel an obligation or a duty to solve it for them? What is the actual problem here?

And I want you to hear this out because there are so many things that come our way. And adults will come up to you and say things.

For example, I was coaching another person yesterday and she said, “Well, I had a teacher come and tell me that another teacher came in late.” And again, my question is, okay, the person came and told you something, which that’s fine. They have the right to tell you that. You can say thank you. But do you have a problem as the principal with the person who came in late? Maybe you do, and maybe you address that. But isn’t it interesting that somebody came to you and told you that because that person also has a problem.

And so when they come to you to tell you this person came in late, that person clearly has a problem with the person coming in late. It’s not just the person who came in late, it’s the person who tattled or told on the other person. So what I coached and mentored this newer principal on was, “Isn’t it interesting that this person would come and tell you that somebody’s coming in late.”

So my response to that person, if I were principal, I would say, thank you so much for sharing that. I really appreciate you being honest with me. And how does it make you feel that this person’s coming in late? Is this person’s tardiness impacting you directly in any way? And the reason I wanted to know that is because I want to ensure that if I address this, that I understand the impact of the other teacher’s tardiness.

Is there something about the tardiness that is directly impacting you? And that creates awareness for the teacher who’s coming to tell you, why did I come and say this? Was I coming to tell? Was I coming to get attention? Was I looking for connection with my principal? Was I just tattling? Was I concerned for the person, but I don’t have a relationship with them? And I’m wondering, maybe something happened? Are they okay? But I don’t feel comfortable going to them.

It creates awareness around the behavior of the person who’s telling. So there are times when people come to us and tell us, this is what’s going on. This is how I feel. I saw this, I overheard this. They’re sharing it with you. And you can be grateful that they’re sharing it with you. But it’s interesting to consider, is it really a problem? Is it this person’s problem? Like, where does the problem lie?

Oftentimes what happens without awareness is somebody comes and says, my colleague is not collaborating with me in the way that I want. She’s not sitting down with me during PLC time and she is not collaborating. And you need to know that. And then you’re like, okay, thanks for sharing with me. How are you feeling about it? Well I’m frustrated, I want to collaborate with her. I’m used to collaborating with the other team I used to be on collaborated and this team doesn’t.

Okay. That’s good to know, but notice how the person coming to you is the person you want to engage in conversation with. What exactly is the problem? Why does it bother you? How is it impacting you? What is it that you see? What do you think this obstacle is in the way of collaboration. What do you think the solution is?

The conversation isn’t, oh, thanks for letting me know and you go now and talk to the other person who has no idea what’s going on perhaps, or maybe they do. But do you see how there is an opportunity for conversation to get to understand the person who came to you about their thoughts and their feelings and what it is they’re looking for and their perception and what they think the problem is and what they think the obstacle is and what they think the solution will be that is an opportunity for connection and conversation with that person before you ever go off running to solve it.

Because here’s what’s happening. Somebody tells you something, you take it for truth, you take it at that face value, and then you go and you try to fix it. You try to change somebody else so that the person who came to you can feel better. Right? It’s the same thing. If a student were to come up to you and say, you know, Sally hurt my feelings. Okay. Tell me more. What did Sally do? What did Sally say? How did it impact you?

You would talk to the child who’s distressed about the circumstance that occurred before you would go and just say, okay, go get Sally and let’s have this conversation. Now, some people might do that, but I’m inviting you into the idea that there may not even be a problem.

So back to the story of my client, when we dug down and I asked her, okay, the teacher that you were considering this difficult conversation with, she gets great results, right? She kind of keeps to herself. So maybe she does find adult relationships a little more taxing for her, a little more challenging for her. That could be true. She said, yeah, I’ve had multiple experiences myself and I’ve heard other people say that she can be a challenge to work with.

I said, but she kind of sticks to herself. She gets her job done. She’s prepared, she’s planned. But ultimately, she has an excellent relationship with kids and she gets the job done. So where is the problem, the actual problem? And we spent about 30 minutes dialing down and it became apparent to the principal, oh, I actually don’t have a problem with her. She’s not, to my knowledge, not harming anybody. She’s not harming children. She’s not negatively impacting anybody. She’s just a teacher who tends to keep to herself. She tends to prep by herself.

And it’s the colleague who is feeling the dissonance, like the discord between the two of them. So let’s talk with that teacher because for her, that’s the problem. The teacher who’s out doing her thing and maybe isn’t collaborating in the way that it should look like we all have, you know, in PLCs, this is how it should look and this is how people should talk and this is how people should collaborate.

But if we are truly in the business of human development, in the business of people, and we’re expecting teachers to embrace, allow, and account for differences, diversity, equity, accommodations. Why would we not model that in our staff? Does every single student need to fit the square? Does everybody need to fit in the box? Or do we differentiate for students? For kids who really struggle with social-emotional skills or really struggle to connect and to relate in the exact way, they might not be able to think pair share or to partner up or to work in a group. Not everybody is designed exactly the same.

And so what we do is we understand children, we get to know them, we get to understand them, we get to understand their triggers, and then we create a space that allows them to still feel safe in their own skin, even if they have neurological differences, biological differences, physical differences, mental differences, emotional, social differences. We create a space that accommodates and allows for flexibility. Can we do this on our staff as well? Can we allow our staff members to be different?

Maybe third grade collaborates differently than fifth grade or first grade. But if it’s working for them, we’re good. Now in this case, you have somebody who’s completely happy doing minimal collaboration and somebody who has a desire for more. So for the person, if they’re not causing harm and they’re not doing anything wrong, you can discuss with them, like, how do they feel about collaboration and what’s working for them and what’s not. But also with the person who doesn’t feel like fulfilled or satisfied, is there another way that that fulfillment can be nourished?

And in this case, we’re talking about intervention. So intervention, it might not look the same as gen ed collaboration or PLC time, might look a little different. And if this person in the intervention position isn’t getting the full collaborative experience she wants with this one colleague, might she be able to fulfill that with someone else, with another colleague? Maybe she can push into grade levels. Maybe she can work with the special ed team. Maybe she can work with anybody on the campus. Collaboration doesn’t exactly have to look like one thing.

Now, I know some of you are going to say, well, she needs to be held to the same exact set of standards as everybody else. And that is an option. You can certainly say, this is the standard, this is the expectation, you must sit down and collaborate. But in the conversation I had with my client, what she discovered is that forcing PLC time, collaboration time to look exactly the same in every single grade level and every single department on her campus might actually be a hindrance to their success.

And so she wanted to take into account is forcing people to look just one way and do it just one way is making people sit down for a certain amount of time and talking in a certain way and taking notes in the exact way. Is that level of management, is that really creating the best results?

So this principal decided I’m going to let the results speak for themselves and I can work with this team to see if we can create more connection in a way that’s authentic for everybody involved, not forcing one person to do it the other person’s way, or one person to have to give up what they want, but living in the land of and helping them collaborate and noticing that one, is this actually a problem?

And two, if somebody’s feeling there’s a problem, who are we actually addressing, being mindful of that, and working with that person to come up with multiple solutions. Because when somebody’s in discord, disharmony, they feel that there’s a problem and they come to you, what’s happening is they don’t feel the way they want to feel about something, whether it’s collaboration or a colleague or whatever. The goal for you as they come to you is, how do they want to feel? And then what multiple options might create and generate that feeling?

So in this case, if that person feels disconnected from her colleagues, might she be able to connect with other colleagues to get the sense of fulfillment and collaboration that she craves? How can she fulfill that need for herself and not need this one person to fulfill that need for her? Especially if the other person isn’t intending to cause harm or discord, they’re just uncomfortable or they maybe have, you know, some neurological or some biological, who knows? There are reasons that people avoid different kinds of collaboration, different kinds of contact.

We want to be respectful and mindful of that. So it could be an opportunity to collaborate with this team and also empower your teachers to find other ways to fulfill their needs so that it’s a win-win. We don’t need to force somebody, particularly an adult who may be a little more adverse to adult connection or a ton of adult stimuli, this communication and connection. If that is overwhelming to some of your adult staff members, let’s be open to allowing for flexibility, diversity, allowance, embracing acceptance, embracing flexibility in how we approach teaching, learning, planning, collaboration, conversation. Something to think about.

Have a beautiful week. Happy March. I hope you enjoyed it. We’re bringing up April. Come on in to EPC. If you are a brand new leader, oh my goodness, get in EPC right now so we can get you started. We can get you planning. We can get you transitioning. EPC is the bomb you guys. I could not love it more. The only thing that would make me happier is all of you coming to join us. It is so, so fun and so worth it. I love you guys. Have an amazing week. Talk to you soon. Bye!

Thanks for listening to this episode of The Empowered Principal® Podcast. If you enjoyed this episode and want to learn more, please visit angelakellycoaching.com where you can sign up for weekly updates and learn more about the tools that will help you become an emotionally fit school leader.

Hello empowered principals. Welcome to episode 376. 

Welcome to The Empowered Principal® Podcast, a not so typical educational resource that will teach you how to gain control of your career and get emotionally fit to lead your school and your life with joy by refining your most powerful tool, your mind. Here’s your host certified life coach Angela Kelly. 

Well, hello, my empowered principles. Happy Tuesday and welcome to the podcast. It’s such an honor to be here with you today. I have another excerpt to share with you from Relationship Mastery. I mean, I really love this Relationship Mastery program. I created it a couple of years ago, but this year I completely rewrote it, the entire thing. I added some of the concepts that I had prior, but I really have gone through my own journey with relationships, professionally and personally. And I’ve gained so much more knowledge and wisdom and understanding. And I’ve done a deep dive in reflecting on how I want to approach relationships and who I want to be in them and how I want to speak and how I want to treat people and how I want to feel about relationships and be in relationships and connection and how I want to feel about myself moving forward.

So this portion of the module is so good because at some point you will most likely run into this scenario as a school leader. I can promise. And it can be tricky because when you’re in it, it’s very hard to see it. You might not be able to catch it when you’re in it. So I hope that this excerpt creates some awareness so that when you’re conversing with somebody and you don’t seem to be getting anywhere, this episode will pop into your head and you’re like, wait, I wonder if this is what’s happening.

So there are people who are going to get upset, right? People who will disagree with you, people who have misunderstandings or people who will be downright mad and they’ll want to discuss their concerns with you. They will come to you and they’re going to express themselves and express some emotion, but at the end of the day, they are people who want to resolve the issue. They want to feel good. They want this resolved. They’re looking for a solution. And they’re coming to you to work in collaboration even though they’re expressing emotions, negative energy. Okay?

Then there are folks who thrive off of conflict. They kind of seem to be energized by it. They get a lot of traction with it. They enjoy making your life a little miserable. And I want you to take note of this type of behavior. It may be coming from someone who has no intention of resolving the conflict.

And this clip will talk about how to look out for people who want to engage in conflict for their own personal benefit, for their own gains, and ways that you can identify this and then approach them in a way that can maybe shut this down for you. They can stay mad for as long as they want. We can’t control that, but I want you to have some tools to be able to identify and then approach people that might be interested in conflict for the sake of conflict. So enjoy this show and again if you’re interested in purchasing relationship mastering the link will be in the show notes. Have a great week everybody. I’ll talk to you next week. Take good care. Bye.

One of the questions I always like to ask is, is there anything else you’d like to share? Is there anything else coming up for you? Let them get it all out. Because a lot of times they’ll be like, oh yeah and then this other thing. Okay. Let it all out. Let them share. And then when they’re done sharing, is anything else coming up for you? Like, okay, they kind of express themselves.

I take say to them, I want to be in partnership with you. I’m very direct about my intention. I want to be in partnership with you. I want to focus on how you’re feeling and how you want to feel. How do you want to feel about this right now? What’s missing? What’s the resolution you’re seeking? What do you think it is that you need? Because I want to understand where you’re coming from.

Now, let me address very quickly, because I know we’re almost at time here. Some people want conflict. Have you noticed? There are people out on the internet, out on the streets, out in the cars, in public. There are people in our schools who actually seek out conflict. They like it. They like the feeling that comes with conflict. They like the adrenaline rush. They like the cortisol. They like the dopamine hits. They crave it. It’s almost like an addiction.

And I’ve thought about why would people want conflict? They’d love to engage in conflict. Well, one, it feels very powerful when you’re coming in all hot and bothered and stomping around and screaming. And it feels like you have power. Actually, you’re completely out of control.

But for the person doing it, it feels like a sense of control. I’m going to be the boss around here and I’m going to stomp around, probably because that’s how they grew up. They probably had parents who stomped around and screamed and yelled, and that was their positional power. They had authority as parents, and that is how they exhibited their power and their authority.

So people grow up and like, well, it’s my turn. Now I get to be like this. It’s a sense of power and control for them. It might also be a need for attention. You can see that on the internet. You can see it in public, like people just creating a scene, undo attention seeking, and they’re trying to get whatever kind of attention they can.

You probably even have kids like this who are like, they like to get in fights because it makes them look cool, makes them look really tough and strong, and people don’t mess with me. It’s an identity. It’s a need for attention. It’s a sense of power and control when they lack it in other ways.

So oftentimes, it’s coming from past experiences. It’s their zone of comfort. It actually feels better to be in conflict because if there’s no conflict, no drama happening, how boring is life, right? It’s the only approach they’ve probably witnessed. But ultimately, it comes back to people who want to have conflict. It’s about how it feels for them. Powerful, empowered, righteous, justified, important, significant, all of those things.

So how do you approach people who want conflict? I’ve had this, I’ve had parents, I’ve had teachers who have actively engaged in conflict because they liked it, because they felt a sense of power, they felt a sense of power over me. And with those people, after going through all of the stuff I’ve just shared with you and trying to come to a resolution and then I’m realizing, wait a minute, this person doesn’t want a resolution. This person wants conflict.

So I will say to them, what’s the solution you’re seeking? And do you actually want that solution? What’s the solution you’re seeking? How do you wanna feel about this? What do you think would make this feel better and why? I make them say to me, what would resolve this for you? You seem very upset.

We’ve talked about this multiple times. You continue to drag it on. You know, this is continuing for you. I can see this continuation of stress and frustration and unhappiness. And I’m really curious, what do you think would make you feel better? And is this resolution that you think that you need? Is this what you’re actually seeking? Do you want a resolution right now? Because sometimes we don’t want it. We don’t want to make it better. That’s okay.

You don’t need for this to feel better right now. You might not actually be ready to solve this problem. If that’s the case, if you need to feel the feelings and process it, I’m here for you. You can feel however you want for as long as you want. What I want to do is the leader as the school, the principal, or your boss, you know, what I want as your leader is for you to feel good. But I also understand on a hold space for your feelings. So what does that look like?

Now, people who want conflict, who love it, who engage in it intentionally, they are fueled by reaction. When you react when you meet them where they’re at energetically, they love that. It’s like putting gasoline on a fire. But if you respond versus reacting, it doesn’t feel as fulfilling for them. Okay? So notice if people are not wanting to give it up, they might be doing that because the conflict is what makes them feel good. You’re not feeling good, but they’re feeling good.

So you can ask them directly and you can say to them, it’s fine for us not to solve this. And then we’re going to set some expectations. And sometimes they don’t even realize they’re doing it. There’s some people who are like, No, you’re actually right. I kind of want to just be mad about this right now. Okay, fair enough. I’ll give you some time. As long as the way you feel is not impacting your students, your colleagues, then you set some parameters around their emotional response. Okay?

So one more time. For team, tune in. E is express emotional energy. A, align your goals with agreements. And then M, meet them in the middle. Because the goal is harmony. The truth is you actually are on the same team. You’re on team human experience. We both want to feel good.

We all want what’s best for the students. We want to be in harmony. People want to feel good. Even people who love conflict. They actually want you to be in harmony in conflict with them. They want you to engage in battle, but that’s a form of harmony for them. And you can decide, I’m not going to engage in that. That’s just not my standard. But when you’re ready, I will engage in harmony because harmony doesn’t mean perfectly aligned, perfect agreement. It means you have different perspectives, but they can blend together kind of in a way that works.

There is a difference and I’ve said it, but I want to be explicit about it. There is a difference between reacting and responding. Reacting is when we act on our initial emotional experience of an exchange with someone. So it’s when somebody sends you an email and you email them right back, or someone yells at you and you raise your voice, or a teacher talks behind your back and you call them out for it in anger. Or a parent complains about you and you defend yourself, right? The reacting, like a responding to the gut reaction, that is a reaction.

Empowered principals, our goal is to respond. We want to pause long enough to shift from our amygdala into our prefrontal cortex. We need a couple seconds to do that. Responding is basically just pausing, pushing pause when you feel a reaction coming. When you’re feeling the reaction coming, you push pause, which is, this is what push pause looks like. Pause yourself. Do not fire off a text. Do not fire off an email. Do not march down to that person’s room. Do not get in the car and go over there. Do not pick up the phone. Pause. Breathe. A-A-B-C-D. Take it back down a notch.

Creating a response comes from the A-A-B-C-D method. It’s how you create awareness, centeredness with intention. How do I want to respond? And you craft a response that’s based on centeredness and then directing your thoughts back to the outcome you desire. Because the goal is to feel good. It has to be an alignment. Whenever you’re in conflict, if you react, we’re going to raise the energy and raise the conflict, we’re going to fuel it. Nobody feels good.

Even the person who loves the conflict, they’re like, whoa, that felt good in a little bit. But also like, now I’ve got to keep this up. It’s a facade that they’re playing because that’s all they know. That’s how they know. They only know how to react. But deep down, people want to feel aligned. They want to feel calm. They want to feel at peace. They want to feel happy. They want to feel good for us as leaders, for them as staff and students, and for the greater good of our communities.

The goal is to feel good. Imagine a school where people felt good, felt good about themselves. They weren’t trying to keep up a facade. They weren’t pretending to be somebody. They were just feeling good about who they were. They felt good about the school they sent their kids to. They feel good about their teachers. Teachers feel good about themselves as teachers. Students feel good about themselves as students. They feel good about their friendships. They feel like they understand how to navigate them. Imagine a school like that. For us, for them, for the greater good.

Relationship mastery. It involves awareness. It involves alignment. It involves momentum. And it involves knowing how to overcome obstacles. You start with awareness, what you’re thinking about. What am I thinking? What’s going on for me in this relationship? Am I creating this conflict? I feel unaligned, I feel misaligned. What’s happening for me? I start with awareness. What do I value? What are my priorities? What is the desired outcome I want? That’s step one.

And then alignment is knowing those desires and those goals, getting clear about what you’re, you know, looking for in this connection, this relationship, how do you want it to feel for you? How do you want it to feel for them? Creating a win-win environment, creating a win-win connection, looking for a meet in the middle, understanding the goal, how it’s a win for them and for you, aligning your actions and communications with that desired outcome.

When you are able to do that, you gain momentum in building relationships, maintaining them, cultivating them. Relationships are alive. It requires you to nurture them with time and attention, to be engaging with them, checking in with people, genuinely caring, listening, being in how energy, honesty, openness, willingness.

And of course, you’re going to have to learn how to overcome obstacles. That’s what we talked about today. All relationships have speed bumps. They have detours, they have speed bumps, they have road delays, it’s just like a road trip, right? We have to navigate that.

Thanks for listening to this episode of The Empowered Principal® Podcast. If you enjoyed this episode and want to learn more, please visit angelakellycoaching.com where you can sign up for weekly updates and learn more about the tools that will help you become an emotionally fit school leader.

Hello empowered principals. Welcome to episode 374. 

Welcome to The Empowered Principal® Podcast, a not so typical educational resource that will teach you how to gain control of your career and get emotionally fit to lead your school and your life with joy by refining your most powerful tool, your mind. Here’s your host certified life coach Angela Kelly. 

Hello, my empowered principals. Happy Tuesday. Welcome to the podcast.

And I am so excited. I have a special guest for you today. We haven’t done an interview yet in 2025. So Kristi here is my first guest on the podcast for the 2025 school year. Her name is Kristi Simons. Is it Simmons or Simons?

Kristi: Simons.

Angela: Simons. Ooh, good catch. Kristi Simons. And she and I met through podcasting and coaching. She coaches teens and works with families with teens. And of course, education, school, coaching, kids, families, we’re here for all of it. So we met, we connected, we just, you know, had an instant connection. And I really wanted her to come on to the podcast and talk with you all about the things that she does and her approach and working with teens.

And I know a lot of you, people that I work with, clients have teens that you’re working with. I have middle school principals, high school principals, and not to mention if you are a principal and you have your own children who are teens and you’re double dipping into the teen development years, this is gonna be a juicy podcast for you. So Kristi, welcome to the podcast.

Kristi: Angela, thank you so much for having me. I feel honored also that I’m the first conversation of 2025. This is super exciting for me. Thank you for having me.

Angela: I’m so glad that we connected. And we really hit it off. I love her work. I love your content. So can you just introduce yourself, tell them who you are, what you do, your passions, your coaching, and really I wanna dive into your work with teens.

Kristi: Yeah, absolutely. I love answering this question or just this part of being on other people’s podcast because whenever they ask me to share about my story, I feel like I learn something new about myself every time as well. And just being able to go back in time and really see the progression, the progress, because that’s been the true highlight of this path for me that I am following now is just progress over perfection. And that’s really the state of mind that I hope that teens can really start to adopt one day as well.

So to tell you a little bit more about myself, I’m actually a former teacher. I taught in the classroom for well over a decade. It was actually my children, so having my firstborn in 2020, that really shook me, shifted me and broke me into a bunch of pieces. And at that time, I can actually remember hearing like this strong whisper telling me that, you know, something inside of me, like there was something in me that knew I needed to change, that I wanted to start creating change, but I wasn’t even sure how.

And a lot of this came back to becoming a mom for the first time and recognizing how much love I felt in that moment, like when they put that baby in my arms and like I felt like I had never felt a love like this before and then I feel like I started to connect these dots like I had never felt that love for myself and it was almost as if the more I tried to connect with him and love him like I was starting to realize that like that was something that I never gave to myself and it brought me back to my teen years and all of the things.

So moving forward through a second pregnancy I ended up having a series of mental health breakdowns, partially too because I suffered from addiction before having my children as well. And so, yeah, like I said, there were just a lot of moving parts during that time and I felt so disconnected from myself. And in hindsight, it’s actually really beautiful that my children were the ones to finally wake me up to that disconnect.

And yeah, so I hired my own coach. Again, when I talk about these whispers and following these breadcrumbs, like there was just this inner knowing within me that I was gonna need like outside support to really help me through this.

And to me at the time, the investment brought up so much, but I’m so grateful that I did because it literally, it changed my life. Having somebody in my corner who could see and believe in me and start to just like guide me back home to myself, it’s been an incredible journey. I’m still with my coach three years later.

And so through all of this, we have the pandemic. And so I was on maternity leaves and then kind of still teaching, but not in the classroom. It was virtual. So yeah, again, a lot of moving parts and there was just a lot of a lot going on at the time.

And I think this was actually in hindsight, again, such a positive thing for me, such a positive change because it allowed me to take a step back and really evaluate if this was still something that I wanted to do for myself. And the more that I was spending time immersed in this coaching experience, the more that I was recognizing that so much of what I was learning, like I wished I learned as a teenager. I wish that somebody was teaching this in the school systems.

And it’s not to say that teachers don’t do an incredible job, but I didn’t know what I knew back then. Or sorry, I didn’t know now back then what I know anyways you get me sure and so come full circle I left my full-time teaching position it’s been close to two years now I’ve been working full-time with families full-time with teens specifically is who I work with I usually connect with the parents but it’s the teens that I end up working with.

And I teach them all about emotional intelligence, essential life skills, and really at the root of it all, it’s to have that deeper connection to themselves. Because what I hear come out of parents’ mouths a lot is like how they really would love for their teen to feel more motivated, more confident, more motivated.

And to me, like the more I look back on my journey and thinking even like about my own motivation, motivation for me comes from that source within, of like deeply trusting yourself. It’s not that you can’t look outside of yourself to co-create and to ask for help and to connect with other people, right? Like we’re meant to connect and we’re meant to merge, but there’s also this really big part of us that desires to be autonomous.

And that’s the part that I really have been nurturing in myself over the last few years. And that’s the part that I helped them to come back home to as well and really building their confidence. So that’s a little bit about me. I could go on forever, but I’m going to stop there.

Angela: I love it. I love the story. I can relate to the feeling of the very first time that you held your son. I have one son who is now 25 and I remember that day as though it were yesterday. And the feeling is so significant.

There is no other experience like it, at least for me. And I love that you connected it back to the love that you felt for him was a love that you hadn’t given to yourself. And that was inspiring just for me right now. So thank you for saying it in that way. And I think we all are on a journey of true self-connection and self-love.

And finding that, whether we’re a teenager or an adult, no matter what age you are listening out there, there is opportunity to connect with yourself and love yourself even more to the point you love yourself as though you would love your own child. Oh, that’s so beautiful, Kristi.

Kristi: If everybody were to lean even just a little bit more into that, because at first, even for me, it felt intimidating. And it was also extremely emotionally uncomfortable even just to say that out loud, like why don’t I love myself? And then to start hearing all of those thoughts and those limiting beliefs and all the stuff that comes up and we can get into that later. But I just imagine a world where people start to lean back into this and when they start to come to that place where they do feel more at home within themselves and they do feel that self-love, like that ripple effect would just be, like it would change, it would change everything.

Angela: Yeah. The question coming up for me right now is, why do you believe that teens struggle with self-love and connection, self-acceptance basically. Self-acceptance, self-love, and I feel like the teen years developmentally, they are an extremely challenging time in terms of their connection with themselves versus their connection with their peers and their identity in the world. Who are they in the world? Who are they at school?

Kristi: Who are they going to become? They’re always asked, what are you going to go to college for? What are you going to do when you grow up? So what is your take on that? So for my podcast, one of my central questions that I ask every guest who comes on is if you could speak to your teen self, what would they need to hear? And so this is usually what I come back to. I feel like this is at the core of everything that I do. Like if I could speak to my teen self, what would she need to hear? And then I build on that.

And I know that back then I was placing a lot of my power outside of myself. So, you know, looking to the judgments, the opinions, the comparisons, all of those things. And I’m seeing this to be very true for my clients as well today. That’s not to say that their experience is the same. They are living in a completely different world, so I always like to acknowledge that.

However, in my coaching and what I do, I also center everything around how do you want to feel. Because for me we are energetic beings, everything comes back to our emotions and the feelings that we are desiring. So again, external stuff aside, they are feeling disconnected from themselves and because they are feeling disconnected and they don’t know how to put those pieces and parts back together, kind of like I didn’t know how to do it before I hired my coach and she taught me what I didn’t know yet, until they can figure out how to start connecting with themselves again, they are going to continue to look outside of themselves for validation, for approval seeking, whatever the case may be, to fill some of those, the word that’s coming up for me right now is like those voids.

And in my sessions, what I’m hearing so often with my clients is that they want to connect with other people, but they’re afraid that like they’re not enough, that their ideas are going to be the word cringy always comes up or that they’re going to look stupid or that people aren’t going to like them, that they’re not going to be seen, heard, understood or accepted. And it’s fascinating to me because I feel like they are so advanced compared to like what I felt like where I was at as a teenager.

And if they could just move past those limiting beliefs and those mental blocks. So I’ll bring it back here. I actually once had somebody tell me that like those thoughts getting trapped in that worry cycle can feel like an undertow. And once you like grab onto that, it just kind of pulls you down.

And so if they don’t know to lean back into love, if they don’t know how to connect with that source, that power that I speak of that they have within, just by way of connecting with, and these are four key areas that I teach in my coaching, it’s mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual energy.

And so going through all of this and really creating, you know, habits around how we want to feel because that’s going to in turn start to shift our beliefs and then we start to create a new reality. But again, it’s something that takes consistency. It takes consistent progress, not perfection.

But it’s really just about connecting with yourselves. And I know from past experience, that was something that I was really afraid to do until I started doing it. So there’s meant to be like that discomfort there, but if it doesn’t challenge you, it won’t change you. So yeah, that’s just some of the stuff that I’m seeing really come up with them.

Angela: Yeah. Yeah. What’s so interesting is how much our work aligns because I’m doing the exact same work with adults and they happen to be school leaders and parents a lot of times. But I noticed that there is a resistance or almost kind of what’s the word I’m looking for, like they kind of scoff at the thought of like self-love and self-care and self-acceptance. It almost, there’s such resistance to it.

And I’m wondering if you see that in your teens as well. Because school leaders, can you imagine if you work with middle or high school students and they have a life coach or even a percentage of them had these tools. Or even better, what I think is if this became a mainstream practice, exercises like just I don’t want to say curriculum, that feels a little too formal for me, but like a way of being part of the vision of the school, if this were a part of the conversation around the, like, dropping the resistance to self-love, self-care, self-understanding, self-deepening, self-acceptance. What do you think is, like, when there’s resistance to that, kind of like, oh, I couldn’t do that or that’s not cool. Like what comes up in the teen mind when you see the resistance come up to like self-acceptance and self-love?

Kristi: I love this question. My mind is firing off in so many different directions.

Angela: I’m sure there’s no one answer, right?

Kristi: Holy moly. I’m trying to reel it in because there’s a lot here. Resistance is just a really big topic. You could really break this down. The first thing that was coming to me is just that obviously resistance is normal. I still feel resistance in my own life towards the things that I have to do, but I have this awareness now and I have this toolkit. Having the wisdom, having the tools that work best for me, because this is never a one-size-fits-all. It’s really about discovering what works best for you.

And I do, as a life coach, I also just feel like I’m kind of just, again, they’re holding the beliefs, asking the right questions so they can come back home to the answers that they already have inside of them. But it’s the inner critic. The inner critic was the other thing that’s coming up for me.

I was working with a client, it was 2 weeks ago, and I just remember them saying, oh my gosh, I didn’t actually realize that there was another voice. Because I teach my clients to learn to think about what they think about, because that was never something I did when I was a teen. I just believed all of my thoughts. I thought all of them to be true. And so this was true for this client too.

I remember I had her write down a list of, okay, so what would your inner critic say? What are some of those things that do come up? Let’s allow them to be seen, heard, and understood in this moment without judgment. She was able to list off a bunch of stuff. Then when I asked her what her inner voice would say, so that place that comes from love, it was completely blocked. There was nothing that she was able to put on that side of her list.

And from like an energetic perspective, because I’m very good at reading people’s energy, like I could tell that her walls were completely up. And that to me is the resistance. We are so resistant to leaning into what an inner voice coming from love would say because we’ve been giving our power to our inner critic. So we’ve really been essentially building that muscle, right? That has become a comfort for us. Our brain also has a negativity bias.

So it’s always going to try to keep us safe, even if it reverts us back to something that is in fact, you know, not helping us to thrive or succeed in our lives. So in order to start creating change, like it’s going to feel uncomfortable, that’s where the resistance will come in. That’s where you’ll hear those thoughts that say, like, who do you think you are to start making these changes or why would you think for my clients?

It’s hard to hear them say that they don’t feel like they’re enough, that they don’t feel like anybody will care. And to me, that’s just, again, them feeling, well, unworthy would be one of them for sure, unlovable. And yeah, so what I have found really helps with this for myself personally and for the clients that do come to work with me is really incorporating mindfulness into this.

And I think that this is an area that would, and I feel like we are, I mean, at least here in Canada, I’ve noticed that there are more mindfulness practices like happening in the schools but that’s just like we’re just like touching the surface right like we really need to get them the information as well but yeah when I can actually have my clients like connect with themselves like settle back into their bodies get out of like the thinking space of just being so up in our heads.

We really need to connect with how our body is feeling. Oftentimes when the resistance shows up, you’ll notice different sensations. Maybe I get tightness in my neck, sometimes in my chest. My emotions will obviously change. I may feel some anxiety, overwhelm, whatever the case may be, and then I hear those thoughts start to spiral, those thought loops of who do you think you are, like you’re not worthy of this, you’re not good enough, yada, you know, those ones that come up.

And so for me, it’s always about just getting grounded. I have to reconnect. I have to ground myself and get those thoughts to just come away and just connect back with my heart. And that to me, I have found has been so helpful because once I’m in that space, that’s when I’m able to, like I’ve regulated my nervous system. If we want to speak to like a scientific perspective, you’re regulating your nervous system.

So you’re allowing, like I was talking about my client, you’re allowing those walls to come down. And then the other voice, the voice of creativity, the voice of love, the voice of abundance, bravery, whatever, you name it, that voice is able to come through and then you get your right next step. For me, oftentimes for resistance, it’s really about moving that energy. Sometimes this looks like going for a walk, taking a few deep breaths. Like there’s so many simple tools available to us each and every day. And yeah, it’s just about figuring out what works best for us. And then also just understanding, I feel like how, you know, the mind, body, soul, all of it is connected.

Angela: I love how you help kids separate out the two voices because I think all of us have a voice of love and I consider it like a voice of truth. Like universal truth. Like you are worthy, you are enough. There’s just like this love and truth that speaks to us.

And it’s a deep knowing, but on the surface of that is this inner critic. And what’s so interesting is we all have one. We all have the inner critic and we didn’t have it at birth. I think about this, right? Like babies are born, you know, straight from source and they get, like, I think about they learn how to walk and talk and play and they’re pure joy. They’re either in joy or they’re in pain and they’re telling you something, right?

It’s one or the other. It’s very all or none and they’re not criticizing themselves for needing milk or needing to sleep or needing a diaper change or learning how to walk and falling and all of those things. So that inner critic, it somehow comes from the experience that we have as humans on the planet and every single person has one. And just the awareness as a teen to know there’s a voice of truth and then there’s this voice of criticism and not enoughness and that’s coming from fear, right? There’s love and truth and then there’s fear over here and that’s protection.

That’s the brain’s way of protecting us, but just that one awareness could change an entire student, child’s life. Just that awareness.

Kristi: To your point, I also feel like when we talk about fear, I’m feeling like, for me personally in my life, and this is my own personal experience, but when I’m feeling like deep fear, it’s actually a fear of feeling its opposite, which is like deep love. It’s like how much more can I expand my capacity to love when I used to lean so heavily into fear? So my fear tries to pull me back and really it’s just a fear of like propelling myself forward into more love.

Like I even notice on a day-to-day basis for myself, right? I’ll have one of those thoughts come in that tells me like, you should try taking action on this. Like this would be such an amazing opportunity. And for a second I’ll be like, oh, I love that. And then the thought, who do you think you are? And then it comes in. And yeah, it’s just like being aware of that and understanding that, as you said, and I think that’s the connection that I made too.

When I had my son, I was just like, oh my gosh. He doesn’t view himself this way. And at one point I was a baby too and I was just as, I don’t usually use the word perfect but it feels right in this moment, like he’s just so perfect right now. Never wanting him to experience I guess the human experience. And then I realized that’s not logical either. We are all here to experience the highs and lows, the waves of life, so to speak.

And I feel like this is just a really opportune time to highlight that through this work that I do with them, we’re always talking about how the inner critic and that inner truth, I love that, I might start using that, how the inner critic and the inner truth can really also merge together and start to co-create. Because for my clients, what I’m seeing is that they will also get down on themselves for having that inner critic and wanting it now that we know it’s there. Like, why can’t we just completely get rid of it? And that’s just not how it works.

And so what I love to do with them, especially in terms of like mindfulness practices, so for that one client that I spoke of, and she’s given me permission to highlight her story if I need to, anywhere that I’m talking about it. But yeah, what I did for her when she was blocked on that list and she wasn’t able to fill in on the other side. I also work with Reiki, so I do energy healing and meditations for my clients.

So just a simple meditation, it was 10 minutes. I just allowed her to settle in her body, take a few deep breaths. We do like a body scan just so again it relaxes everything, really takes them out of their head and back into their truth. And I just guided her. I guided her through the things that had come through the session, again, giving and bringing awareness to that inner critic.

And I had her see herself, like visualize herself in her mind as the version of herself, her truth that she knows that she is, but then also meeting her inner critic there and just giving her a big hug, like just giving her a big hug because you’re right. It’s just so much external stuff that has come at us. It’s nobody’s fault. Everybody, I truly believe to my core, is well-intentioned. It’s just we don’t know what we don’t know, right?

And so we do. We absorb all of this information and then we start to think that there’s something wrong with us, when in fact there’s nothing wrong with us. We are born perfect and worthy. And so in that visualization, I had her hug and just really bring acceptance to understanding that this was just a part of her that’s trying to keep her safe, but that she could put herself in the creator role.

And then I had her ask herself, like, what is something that you would tell your inner critic that you believe are your actual truths? And when she came out of that meditation, she had three to add to her list, which I think is just, like, to me, that’s such a huge win. And I remember one of them was that like, nobody’s perfect. Like life’s not meant to be perfect and it’s okay to like love and accept herself. That she was a very empathetic person and that was one of her strengths and one of her gifts. And I don’t know if I’m going to be able to remember what the last one was. It might come to me as we’re speaking, but yeah, it was just, and again, from going from only being able to hear that one voice from then making the distinction and now she has three and that will anchor itself in.

Like now those have become new beliefs and it doesn’t mean that it’s going to override, but we just, we need to start nurturing that side more so that it can remind the inner critic that we are creating from this place now.

Angela: Yes, oh, that is so, so beautiful. And I do agree with you. I guess I think we babies, brand new babies are just a source straight from perfection. And, but it is the human experience to have the duality of life. And I think the duality of life is how we continue to know the truth. There has to be some kind of opposition, right? There has to be some kind of, what’s the word I’m looking for? Like a reflection or a balance of how do you, like if it’s always perfect and sunny out, you know, you never know, you know, what it’s like to have this cozy, warm, wintry day or the rainy days, or, you know, to enjoy that day.

I lived in California for 30 years and it’s almost always sunny and you almost take it for granted because there’s not a lot of dichotomy or there’s not a lot of difference. And so when you have a rainy day, you’re like, wait, what? You’re either annoyed by it or you’re like, I forgot how much I love a beautiful rainy day. Well, here in Nashville, I’m getting all seasons all at the same time. So it’s fun to think about.

But there is that duality in the human experience, which I remember wanting to bubble wrap my son and protect him from the world. I remember when he was little thinking, I don’t ever want to see him go through his first heartbreak, his first love heartbreak. Right. And then it happened and it was excruciating as a mother. And I thought he’s living, he’s alive. This is a part of the human experience.

And luckily, having the tools to hold space for him and be with him in that moment and not try to coach him out of it, but to coach my own feelings about how I felt with him and then allowing him to have his own feelings for as long as that took and for him to process that situation and that breakup, it really made me realize, no, I want him to have the capacity to handle any emotion that comes his way, to handle any experience that comes their way. And the gift of just having access to these tools can give kids so much more. We talk about in schools, we talk about grit, we talk about resilience, we talk about stamina.

And I’m going to say something that it may ruffle some feathers, but I believe when you said earlier that in Canada, they’re talking about mindfulness, but it’s kind of on the surface. I think this is true of all educators because we haven’t been having these conversations as part of the norm, as part of just the repertoire of education and human development, we as the adults are on the surface, and we can only teach to the capacity at which we’re willing to go below that surface of mindfulness and to, as teachers, as staff members, as administrators, talk about our own inner critic with ourselves, right? We don’t need to put it on blast in front of our colleagues, but to have the awareness and to have these conversations as adults with ourselves and with those we trust, but to be mindful ourselves of our own reactions of our own emotional regulation.

Because the number one thing that I coach on all week long around the calendar is principals and district leaders. And, you know, sometimes I work with state officials, but primarily its district and site administrators, and they spend their day with, how do I handle emotional regulation for myself, and how do I hold space, and how do I navigate the emotional experiences and the emotional expressions of other adults? I very rarely coach on kids. Like a situation with a kid, it’s more about their experience with the adults, whether that’s the adults on campus or the adults as family members, parents coming in and they’re highly dysregulated, or maybe it’s your boss or your supervisors who have their own emotional experience, their own human developmental experience. We’re all on this journey.

And being able to hold that space as a teacher for all of your kids and all of those parents and your grade level team or your department team and your colleagues, and then you go home and you have your family and you’re trying to hold space emotionally for your own children and your partner, your spouse, your friends, your family, that it can feel like a lot to hold on to.

Kristi: Yeah. I feel like it is like navigating it. Navigating it is definitely not a linear path. And I love when you talked about holding space because it’s so true. There is this depth beneath the surface. I feel like we kind of touch on the waves if we’re using the water as our metaphor here. But you have the waves on the surface, right? So maybe in the classroom, we see those waves and we’re like, perfect opportunity to throw in a mindfulness practice. Is this gonna benefit them? 1000% it’s going to, but like, what is the reason? Like what’s underneath it all? Like, why, you know, why are we doing this? Like, they really need to have a connection and an understanding to that.

It’s like what’s beneath the surface? What are we actually connecting with when we do these practices? And I feel like that may be the piece that’s missing. And you’re right. What I’ve noticed with myself over the last five, almost six years of doing this work is that even in order for me to hold space for other people and for me to be an active listener, I have to create space within myself. So in order to hold space for other people, you need to create that space within yourself. Otherwise, they’re just getting the surface level you and the surface level me can often also be irritated and feeling a little bit overwhelmed.

This obviously happens with my toddlers and so I’m very conscious of that now and there are still a lot of moments where I have to, you know, go back and repair because like I said this is not a linear journey. Even for me somebody who is doing this work like I still have my moments where I know that there’s just more space needed. My cup is empty, so to speak, so I have to fill that back up. I need to know how or which ways it works best for me to actually connect with myself, whether that be through journaling, like I said, going for a walk. It’s all of our energies. It’s paying attention to the mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual. Mental is our own limiting beliefs and our thoughts, our narratives that come up. And again, if we’re dysregulated, it means that we’re in our mind.

So if you’re trying to hold space for somebody, but you’re feeling dysregulated, you’ve got thoughts swirling. If you’ve ever had a conversation with somebody and afterwards, you’re like, oh my gosh, I have no idea what that person just said to me. I have no idea.

This happens with… My husband won’t listen to this, so that’s okay. He already knows this is true though, but this will always happen for us. He’ll tell me something and then like 20 minutes later, I’ll ask him, okay, so what are you guys doing at work tomorrow? And he’s like, I just told you. And I’m like, oh no, because I wasn’t fully there. I was not fully present. And so it’s just being aware of it. It’s always giving ourselves compassion too, as we do this work, because we are literally retraining ourselves. We’re trying to break old patterns that we’ve been following for so long.

And I love that you brought up the holding space. And I do believe that holding space starts with yourself. So the mental energy, then the physical energy. This comes back to how we are actually fueling ourselves, the amount of sleep, like the way we talk to ourselves, like our bodies, like what we’re putting into our bodies. And again, I never come at this from a place of like, there’s certain foods that you should or should not eat. It’s all about what feels good to you and not shaming yourself in that area of your life either.

Your physical environment, ever since I immersed myself in a community of women who are all holding this belief for one another that we can move our lives in this direction versus falling back to where we do not want to be anymore, that has made a significant impact on me because there are still other little containers of space in my life where those aren’t the conversations that are being had. And those tend to deplete me at this point. So it’s nice to have that space where I can come back to that language of self-love, confidence, and empowerment that I’m searching for.

There’s also emotional energy. So this is understanding your emotions. It’s emotional intelligence, teaching them about like the emotional guidance scale, just about gratitude, about hopefulness, about love, about abundance, about how their lives are actually limitless as long as they continue up that spiral. And again, it’s always okay to spiral back down into those feelings of overwhelming anxiety, whatever it is, sadness, fear. And it’s just that’s where the resilience piece comes in is knowing that you can get back up and keep going whenever you’re ready and whatever small next step you’re meant to take.

And then there’s spiritual energy. If spiritual doesn’t resonate, you can just call it self-energy. It’s really that deeper connection to yourself. Are you actually putting things on your calendar that are going to help you co-create the way that you want to feel?

So for me, I actually have a whole energetic with my planning process, but I do as a former teacher. It’s that concept of reverse engineering rather than having the expectation. The expectation for me is how do I want to feel today? And then I will just jot down some of the things that come to mind. Maybe for me it is going for a walk. Maybe for me it’s actually taking like 30 minutes to paint or draw because I love doing that. I always love doing that as a teen.

And what are we here for if we can’t still enjoy some of the things that we used to do when we were younger? Like to me, I’m just like, what the heck is the point? And I find when I do put those things on my calendar, even if it just is 30 minutes to sit down and color or draw for a little bit, it will 10X my capacity to be able to show up for the other things in my life that I need to show up for simply because I listened to myself.

And this is how I’m seeing that the confidence is being built, because you’re just compiling this evidence that you do trust and choose yourself. And then it opens up more creative flow rather than keeping you stuck in that mindset of lack and scarcity and fear.

Angela: That’s so, so beautiful. I love that you use the water as an analogy because there’s the surface and we have feelings on the surface. And the goal isn’t perfection. The goal, I think about school leaders who are like, or teachers who are like, one more thing, now I’ve got to be mindful, now I’ve got to add mindfulness and I’m going to add this to the plate. I don’t think it’s about adding to the plate. I actually think it’s about awareness. I don’t think the goal is perfection. We all know that we strive for that, but the actual goal is awareness.

So awareness when you win and acknowledging and validating the success or the win or what is working in your life and focusing on that, it’s awareness. But then the emotion when you’re feeling positive, that’s awareness. That’s an opportunity for awareness of what’s working and what you love and what’s happy.

And then when you’re not feeling if you’re feeling on the I think of, you know, like emotional bandwidth is like, you know, positive, negative, on the negative spectrum. That’s awareness. It’s like, oh, I’m not feeling great or this doesn’t feel good. Why? It’s the awareness. The emotion is the tool that we use to leverage what’s working versus what’s not working for us. And it’s the awareness of why we’re feeling the way we’re feeling to generate that because underneath that initial feeling is the momentum, it’s waves, it’s below the surface, the undercurrent that’s going on underneath the surface of the water is where how deep are we willing to go to find out what we’re feeling and why we’re feeling it?

I think those are the two most brilliant questions. It’s what am I feeling and why am I feeling it? Because you have to stop and you have to pause and you have to ask yourself like, wait, why do I feel this way? And then your thoughts are going to, I call it a brain drain where it just like all comes out, right?

So I have a question. You mentioned something about kids if they can stay in the spiral up. And I just was coaching a client on this. So I think it’s going to be very relevant for teens and families and adults.

When somebody is coaching with you and they are creating this awareness and they can see the difference between the inner critic and the voice of truth and love, and they’re starting to feel differently, and they’re starting to think differently, and they’re connecting to themselves, do they have moments where they’re like, now I feel more isolated? I feel more weird. Nobody’s talking like the way I’m talking, or nobody’s thinking like the way I’m thinking, or my coach and I can be real with my coach, but then I go back with my friends and they’re all talking about whatever, gossiping or boys or whatever kids talk about these days, TikTok and all of that, but how do you coach them through as they’re evolving themselves and expanding their awareness, how do they still feel connected to their peers who maybe don’t have access to the coaching tools or the awareness strategies?

Kristi: I love that. Oh, I love this because this is actually like you just brought up one of, I would say, the main challenges is once they start to have more awareness for how they want to feel, they’re definitely going to be more aware, even more so of what’s going on around them and their environment. And so this is where, and again, I always bring it back to my life too. It’s been like a game changer for me to have a container of space where these conversations are still being had. So I have that space where I feel seen, heard and understood.

I can express myself openly, authentically, and I still encourage them to do this in their own lives. And I can also understand how, like when they’re in their school community And if there’s nobody else that’s really understanding them on a deeper level, this is why I’m talking like it’s so good to have like those safe spaces or that group of people or that one person even. It really just takes one person in their corner that sees and believes in them. So that’s important to highlight as well. But yeah, it’s just continuing to have conversations with them, continuing to encourage them to not dim their light just because they’re afraid of the projections of others, and also just helping them to build a set of tools, something that will help them to move through those times in their lives.

I wish I could say that there’s a right answer and we can just fix it all. And the truth is that they’re going to come up against these blocks, these mountains in their lives that are going to challenge them, right? It’s like, do I in this situation continue to just trust and choose myself or do I dim my own light to follow others? And they’re also still growing and exploring. And a lot of this for them is still like their brains are still developing.

So a lot of this is new. So I think it’s just allowing them to just be very like open minded to everything and just allowing their experience to be what it’s going to be. But if as long as they have a safe space that they can come back to, where they can talk to somebody about what’s going on, I feel like that’s like the number one place to start right now for them, is just having that person that they feel that they can trust.

Angela: Yes, I coach on this with my principals who they get into, they start one-on-one coaching with me and now I offer group coaching and they’re in the group coaching program. So in that container, it’s just, it’s like a bubble of safety and we can talk about expansiveness and our feelings and really kind of push the envelope to the edges of how deep we’re willing to go with these conversations about how good life can get. And we really can play in that space and feel very safe and it feels very confidential and you feel trusting because it’s like-minded people.

So I do believe that like having those containers are really important. And that’s like the ideal. Like you wanna be surrounded by people who are like-minded. But when you’re first starting this, and I’ll just share my own personal experience for any teen who’s listening out there to this, happens to be listening to this podcast or a school leader or educator.

In the beginning, there is what my first coach ever that I had, Dr. Martha Beck, she called it the ring of fire, where there is a moment when you have awareness, there is a moment that you feel in the reconnection to yourself. You do feel a disconnect from those who are also disconnected from themselves because you’ve reconnected with yourself.

So you’re reconnecting and you’re learning and you’re creating this awareness. And when you’re in it, you’re like, I want to tell the world, I want everybody to know this. And then people are like, what? Because they’re disconnected, they can’t, they’re not on the same frequency as you. They don’t understand it. They can’t comprehend it. And then they’re like, oh, is she weird or different? And then it kind of reclose you back to like, wait, am I being the weird person or am I being the off person?

There is a moment of this decision that you make, but I want to say something to teams. Like if you’re working with Kristi and you are, and you feel this like truth and love and lightness that comes with working with her. And then you go with your friends and you’re not feeling that it’s okay to feel that discomfort. Number one, number two, it’s normal. You’re going to feel that discomfort. Three, it’s temporary.

And this is what I want to share with you, that you will kind of feel a chapter or a moment where all you can think about is this because it feels so good. And you go and you’re out in the world with other people and you might feel like, oh, they’re talking about things that aren’t as meaningful to me anymore. I don’t relate to or connect to anymore. But eventually what happens is you get yourself to a space where one, you start to gravitate and you attract more like-minded friends and circles. And that might happen for you if you’re middle school to high school or high school to college. So you will start to attract more people.

But the other thing that happens is your ability to engage with people who don’t understand you, your tolerance for that goes up because you won’t need them to acknowledge you and to validate you and to listen to what you need to say because you’ve done that for yourself. So you can actually go out and enjoy your circle of friends and love them just for who they are and appreciate them and be with them, while you still have this expansion and awareness within you, that will happen.

And it will, because you’re so young, through the course of time, it’s going to feel like you’re the one being isolated. But what’s really happening is you’re the one that’s reconnecting. And then you see them in a light where you can actually just love them for who they are and embrace them. And if you truly aren’t aligned anymore as friends, that friendship will run its course and you’ll meet new friends.

But I do think this, I am on social media, obviously to connect to people. And what I’ve seen is there is a trend. There is a wave of coaching coming down into from maybe the thirties and forties where people at midlife were like, I need a coach. Now to like 30s where I see parents embracing coaching for the sake of being the best version of themselves as parents for their children. And now you’re starting to hear teenagers talking about it.

I am personal friends with coaches who are barely over the drinking limit age, right? They’re in their early to mid-20s and they’re out there. I have a friend, I should actually have her on the podcast. She is a friendship coach and she teaches people how to make friends like post school and college. So I just want you to know that, yes, there are people out there who are in, they’re just a little bit older than you and they’re doing this work. You can follow them on your Instagram, your social medias, your TikToks, wherever you guys are on listening and following, there are people out there that can just remind you that you’re not alone.

It’s so much about shifting the language, like shifting the language, but kept coming up for me. And yes, like again, acknowledging that there

Kristi: There are going to be moments of discomfort. There still are for me in my life, especially now that I, like, I know that this is a direction that feels so aligned to me. My resistance tends to come up even more so than before. And what I wanted to say about that too was just in terms of like, you said the teacher, whoever would be listening and maybe thinking like, oh my gosh, another thing to add to my plate, right?

Before I could see and believe it for myself, like I really needed somebody to see it and believe it for me before I could see it and believe it for myself. And that’s who my coach was to me and still is for me. And so like to those people, if they’re having those thoughts, like I believe in you, I believe that you can move past those stories and those limiting beliefs, because to me, it’s not even about putting another thing on my plate at this point.

It may have felt that way in the beginning. Now, I feel like I’m being served a buffet on a daily basis. The more I fill myself up, the more simple things feel. Again, it’s just, it’s starting something new. It’s starting fresh. It’s leaning in a different direction than we’re used to leaning to. So yeah, there’s going to be discomfort. And again, you’re going to try to be pulled back into that safety zone, that comfort zone where you’ve always been doing what you’ve been doing. And if you feel like that’s working for you, then you can continue to do that. That’s your free choice and your free will.

But I’m just here to always remind you that the belief is there because somebody held it for me. So I will not stop shining that light now because if my coach would have stopped shining her light, I wouldn’t be where I am today. Well, maybe I would have found another coach, but she has been the reason for so much of the transformation in me. And so I’m always reminding myself of that. Like I would be doing others a disservice by not showing up and having these conversations and at least letting them know that when they’re ready, I believe in you and you can make some of these changes in your life too. It just starts with small habits and then just building on those habits over time.

Like this doesn’t have to look like tomorrow you wake up and your life looks completely different. It’s just, what’s one, like, how do I want to feel today? And what’s one thing I can do to lean into that versus its opposite?

Angela: Yes, so good. So yeah, educators out there, I just want you to know that coaching is just teaching. And I think about, you know, I could not have, none of us go through life without a teacher. I don’t know of a person who’s gone through life without some sort of mentor, teacher, or actual coach, whether that’s a fitness trainer or a spiritual, you know, counselor or mentor, parents, your, maybe your auntie or uncle, your grandparents had influence. There’s somebody out there in the world who was coaching, mentoring, teaching that, and you as educators, all of us parents, we’re all teachers.

Coaching is just teaching, teaching as coaching. It’s funny that people are like, well, what’s a life coach? What do they do? We help you create awareness around, I call them like the blind spots, right? We all, like when you’re driving a car, there are blind spots, which is why we have the mirrors and coaching provides the mirrors and the reflection into ourselves and to what’s happening around us from different perspective and angles, just like teaching.

So it’s nothing to be afraid of. It’s actually, I think it’s one of the most reassuring relationships that I have with my coach and I will never not have a coach. I’ll tell you that right now. I will never not have a coach. Yeah.

So Kristi, this conversation has been so enlightening and I want school leaders to know how to access your information and content so that they can pass it on to parents who might be interested in finding their teen coach. Because I think you’d connect with parents and teens, correct? Yeah. So how can the listeners connect with you, get your resource and information so that they can be passing your services along to families?

Kristi: I love this. Thank you. First, so much for having me. I knew that, well, when we first met, that first conversation that we had was enlightening as well and just felt so connected. And whenever I have these conversations and I truly feel energized at the end. Again, this is like a part of me showing up to fill my cup. So I just appreciate you for helping me to do that today and holding the space.

So Confident Teen Podcast is where I love to hang out. My podcast is my baby. So yeah, you can find it anywhere you listen to podcasts. And I also am fairly active, I would say, on Instagram so you can find me @ConfidentTeenTeacher. And what else did I want to add? My website is https://kristisimonscoaching.com. So that’s K-R-I-S-T-I-S-I-M-O-N-S. And yeah, everything that you need to know about my services, about me, all of that information is there, like bookings for speaking and all the things.

And lastly, I would just like to add, and this is something I’m wondering if you could just throw maybe into the show notes, but I do have a freebie right now. If parents are interested, I created what I’m calling The Truth List, cracking the teen code and I created this because I was noticing a through line with all of the teens that I was working with or have been working with and even back to like my days in the classroom that teens are just so connected.

Like I can literally see and visualize in my mind that like they’re all holding like the same golden thread and the golden thread is like all of like their deepest desires and then also you know like the entanglement of all of those limiting beliefs and stories that they tell of themselves that prevent them from really connecting with that and so The Truth List is to show parents like when your teen is telling you like I don’t know nothing’s wrong or you literally just get silence.

These are some of the things that they are thinking in terms of like the blocks that they have showing up for them. And then again, those desires that are coming up for them are. For me, it’s just, it always blows my mind because you would think it would be those material things that they want a new bike, a new video game, whatever the case may be.

And honestly, it comes back to connection. It comes back to acceptance. It comes back to just being able to feel like they’re free to use their voice, free to express themselves, free to be creative. So yeah, you can get that. I’ll give you the link for that and we’ll put that in the show.

Angela: Yeah. We’ll put all of that contact information in the show notes. No problem. And I think that these are the conversations that are going to really spark a resurgence in education. I think COVID actually did us a huge favor because it shook us up.

It shook an institution up to the point of no return, where we can’t unsee, we can’t unfeel, we can’t unknow that there is room for growth and room for awareness in the field of education. And doing things the way we did them a century ago might be time to bring up some awareness. And one of the things I think we do really well in education is we avoid talking about feelings. We avoid talking about emotion because of our discomfort with it as adults, and because of what we’re afraid will happen if we open Pandora’s box when we talk about emotions.

But what will actually happen is the process of awareness, validation of our feelings, and then the regulation of them, which cannot occur if we haven’t acknowledged the feelings or validated them and process them.

So this is just the beginning of beautiful conversations that can be had with your team, with your staff, and with yourself. So, Kristi, thank you for your wisdom, your insights today. This was beautiful. I couldn’t love this conversation more and I really appreciate you taking the time to be on the podcast today.

Kristi: Yes, thank you so much for having me. I appreciate you too.

Angela: You’re so welcome. All right, folks, that’s a wrap. Kristi Simons will put all of her information in the show notes, and I wish you a very empowered week. Take good care. Talk to you soon, bye.

Hey empowered principal. If you enjoyed the content in this podcast, I invite you to join the Empowered Principal® Collaborative. It’s my latest offer for aspiring and current school leaders who want to experience exceptional impact and enjoy the school leadership experience.

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